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Topic: Religion

Adam Our Father

muslim america
April 30, 1999 Shuyukh

God, Majestic is He and Merciful, created all that we see save man, and in what He created there was none who could be to Him a companion and friend, to know Him and love Him as He should be known and loved. All that lived and all that had sentience which He had created in them knew their Creator and Lord and all did as He intended for them by the nature of their creation. But to none could God Open His Mind and share what He in His Omniscience knew and what He in His Omnipotence had done in creating the Creation as He had. None living and breathing and thinking could know the magnitude of His Mercy or the breadth of His Dominion or the magnanimity of the gift He had given to each by breathing into it of Life, while He is The Living. For this reason He created man.

So just as He had called every thing into existence with His "Be!" and it was, so then did He create our father Adam by saying to him "Be!" But the first Adam did not know Him and love Him as He deigned to be loved and known, and after thousands and thousand of Adams were created and with their own volition that He had created in them chose other than what God would have had them choose, then He created Adam who is our father. God has said that our creation in Adam is the finest thing that He has created.

Our father knows no peer or equal since his time among us, his children. And he knows each and every one of us, our families, our children, our joys and our trials, our failure and success. Because that is what God created in him: all of us. And God Opened His Mind to Adam, that whatever God knows that the mind and heart of man can know, Adam knew. Looking at all of us in the Palms of God's Hands, Adam knew of us what God knows; saw of us what God sees; loved of us what God loves, in Communion and Companionship with God,as he was created to do.

And then Adam displayed his singular feature that is man and human and makes of us what we are and in its operation is what endears us to God, Who created it in us and brought it to fruition as the nature of humanity in Adam: he forgot. And in a forgetful moment, he tripped, partaking of the argument of the rebellious Satan, his enemy and arrogant out of envy against God's creation of Adam, entertaining for the briefest of moments what this liar said of God and His creation, humanity. And God closed His Mind to Adam and he fell from Communion with Him and His Knowledge, taking a hundred years to reach the ground upon which we walk and in which we will be buried.

The rest, as they say, is History. And this is a poor sample of its beginning, the story is so much more than we have placed upon this page. And History, likewise, is partly shown and mostly hidden, as Satan continues to prove his case against man that, even though Adam knew God and loves Him, he is not the better suitor for His Affection and Friendship than is the Deceiver of man, who tripped Adam when he was forgetful of His Lord.

And beyond History is Faith: that as God promised Adam in consolation after the Fall, and that as God promised Noah to assuage his grief after the Flood, and that as God has made known to all of those He has sent among us to tell us of His Ways that He has designed for us, that He will again Open His Mind to Adam, and to the children of Adam, flooding the earth with His Knowledge and His Mercy, that He might be Known and Loved as He should be Known and Loved.

And this story is known to the keepers of every faith, of Judaism, of Christianity, of Islam; and of the sons of Noah all three are to share in His Mercy and their time has come.


Posted by: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
04/30/99 02:49:51 PDT

To: ankaboot
In this world of today, where all are at each other's throats, where even those who gather in common cause on this forum spend far too much time in mutual thrust and parry, how will "The People of the Book", who all believe in the same God yet disagree on so many fundamental issues, finally (or ever) come together?

What does the Koran (please pardon if I have misspelled) say about the last days of all "The People of the Book"?
From: logos (logos@searnet.com) *
04/30/99 03:03:04 PDT


To: logos
I wish God's Peace for you, and His Mercy and His Blessings. The tone of your message says that you are of those of whom I have often said "Those who love God can always find a way to be at peace with one another."

You have asked what the Qur'an says of the Children of Israel, the Helpers of Jesus, and the muslims, during this Day of ours which has only just begun. I do not have the chapters and verses immediately to mind, and instead must say what I recall, and as I recall it.

God has charged the muslims to be vigilant against a tendency to impose on others the beliefs that one holds dear, out of love and concern for them and from a desire that all men have that humanity should be one and without discord or disagreeent in matters of serious importance for all who love God and wish to care properly for the bountiful and fair creation that He has entrusted to our care.

For this reason we are told to aid the Children and the Helpers in their affairs and not to interfere with the way in which they believe, worship, live together, and govern their own conduct within their respective Houses. We are told not to argue or contend, but to agree to serve God, together or separately, and with singular accord. We are told that when God brings His Plan to fruition, there will be in His Kingdom community upon community and house upon house filled with the Children of Israel and the Helpers of Jesus and the muslims, each living in peace with all of his fellows, and even others who love and serve Him by His Names of which each is given but a few.

As muslims we know of His Kingdom, for our ancestors from among the muslims lived in it for nearly a thousand years, during all of which time it was passing away and becoming like the kingdoms of men even though there was the Light of God in it and the Children of Israel, the Helpers of Jesus, and the muslims lived together in it and brought about a standard of living that has not been seen in the world before or since. As time passed, a great number of terrible things happened to cause the muslims to forget what God has written on us respecting those of other faiths; and except for those who visited the muslim lands, which were the entirety of the Holy Land and the Promised Land and extended also from China to Spain and from the middle of Asia to the middle of Africa; those of Europe, living in the domains of the Church, knew nothing of what was going on across the sea of Bosporus and beyond every border. The knowledge that Jews, Christians, and muslims developed in the millenial muslim world fired the Renaissance and brought light to the Dark Ages and underlie much of what we enjoy today. And just as the Light that filled the Kingdom of David and the Kingdom of Solomon remains with us today in our institutions and knowledge, so also does the Light that filled the Holy Land remain with us today in similar measure to bring all of humanity within reach of an end to those things that perpetually have plagued us: hunger, war, disease, corruption, and fear of want.

So the Qur'an tells us that He will establish again what He has given humanity before, for a Day the measure of which is fifty thousand years. And in that Day all who seek the Pleasure of God will be enabled to find it, Jew, Christian, muslim, and Folks we don't even know or see. And as God told Adam, and Noah, and Abraham and Moses and David and Solomon and Jesus, He will again Open His Mind to humanity that we may know with His Knowledge and see with His Vision for humanity that which we could not have imagined before. And He makes no distinction between one and another of those He has sent to us, but all may rest in His Shadow as all of us were ever intended to do.

It may seem to you that I have left out much, and that is undeniably true. For there are those who do not want to know Him, who do not believe He exists, and who choose to remain independent of Him, although none are independent and free of need but He; and away from Him, although He is always present and never is absent; and uninterested in Him, although there is nothing which can meet the eye or the mind that is not of His Provision for us. And while the people of faith and reason and sense have from Him, each in his own house of faith, all that is needed to guide us in the conduct of our affairs and in the resolution of our differences, by what light will one who does not know Him and does not care to know Him make the choices that will preserve him in good fellowship with his neighbors? And as you might imagine I would say, it is the case that each of us is his brother's keeper, and it is the burden of the elder, or the wiser, or the more peaceful and knowledgeable, to aid the weaker without a hint that he is that, to aid the ignorant without making of his ignorance an occasion of his distress, to aid the infirm without mockery of his infirmity, but with kindness and mercy as He has shown Kindness and Mercy to us; and for that task God equips all of us with His Love and His Light that we may aid those who walk in darkness and know not the joy that others share. The path to felicity is not only mapped out in the Qur'an: in each of the Books that He has given us for guidance there is laid out His Plan for human existence. And it is by following those paths, as God shows each his way, that the benefit of God's great Love for humanity may and will extend to all, that it may be known and said that in Abraham, all families of the earth are blessed.

And God has given me what He has given me in answer to your question, while whatever is in it that fails to convey or misleads is mine and mine alone, so that I ask Him to protect you and me from the harm of any error I might have made.
From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
04/30/99 03:59:37 PDT


To: ankaboot
Thank you for your response. The depth of care evident in your reply far exceeds even my highest hopes.

I must confess that all I know about the Muslim faith I gleaned from James Michener's The Tell, and while I am confident he was as factually correct as he could be, I don't have the same confidence in his faithful rendition of your belief. Because I know so little, you will pardon me if I take some time to digest what you have said.

Off the top of my head, some immediate reactions:

It is indeed unfortunate that the national media focuses inordinately upon the "fanatics" of our respective faiths, rather than those of us who would strive to reach out in God's love. Fair or not, in the post-modern world in which we live, our God is judged (ironic that man judges God) by the words and deeds of those who publicly proclaim their faith. Consequently, "fundamentalism" has become a curse word in the current lexicon, regardless of the faith being represented.

It would seem, at least from the information available in the public domain, that none of our faith communities can (or would want to) claim a monopoly on those who prefer to pick and choose from our respective "Books" only those tidbits that support their already-selected ideologies. We all have our charlatans. I'm curious - does the Qu'ran (is that correct?) include the parable of the wheat and tares, or its equivalent?

As I said, I need to do some reflecting before making any attempt at a more serious reply, but I thank you for giving me the opportunity to do just that.

Peace.
From: logos (logos@searnet.com) *
04/30/99 05:23:32 PDT


To: logos
All I know about the Muslim faith is that they deny the authority of scripture, they deny God's promises to Israel, they deny God's provision of a Saviour through Jesus Christ, they deny Christ died on the cross, that salvation is by grace through faith in Christ, just the simple Bible truths, they deny them. Sorry, that's all I know.
From: RaceBannon (jimban@snet.net) *
04/30/99 15:11:20 PDT

To: RaceBannon
So, should I deny that they exist? I don't think so. Should I refuse to reply to a friendly word? I don't think so. C'mon, RB - you've seen me around the place...I'll be all right.
From: logos (logos@searnet.com) *
04/30/99 15:15:27 PDT

To: ankaboot
I'm confused....
In the first paragraph you say God created everything save (except...as I understand the context) man.
In the second paragraph Adam is created, but it didn't work out right so multiplied MORE Adams are created until finally Adam (our father?...who art in heaven?)is created, and that God considers US as his finest work in Adam.

That denies the soveriegnty of God.

It is Satan who desires to lift himself to be equal to God.

I'm sure the story IS more than what is being posted here but I must agree with Race,
Too many Christian doctrines are denied for this to be sympathetic with Jesus (The only begotten Son of God) and the redemptive work on the cross by Jesus that we, sinful humanity, might be saved.
From: knarf (fgapa@wpcd.com) *
04/30/99 15:59:41 PDT


To: ankaboot
Interesting screen name!

Ankaboot (Ankabut)=Spider????? Chapter 29 of the Qur'an?


From: GI Jane (emailname) *
04/30/99 16:47:02 PDT


To: RaceBannon
as-salaamu 'alaikum! (God's Peace for you)

I could list the things that you deny, but for what? Were I to believe as you, I would not be muslim but rather a Christian. What Islam says is that God will straighten us out in His good time, and in the meanwhile we have a world full of people to care for, and those who deny faith entirely -- yours, mine, and any other -- are opposed to all of us. I am not interested in persuading you to my view. I am interested in strengthening your faith in God and in aiding you in the good things that you and your fellows do, or not aiding you as you might prefer, but in any case not in contending with you and allowing rancour and bitterness to enter as Satan wishes for all of us.

Muslims may not deny the authority of Scripture. Some do. But you may note that your Scripture says "All scripture is inspired of God and beneficial." I think there may be more words to the passage. Do you deny that muslims are among those who have been given Scripture? Should that be the case, then you are out of step with many Christians who acknowledge otherwise. But again -- should you deny that Scripture, I am not interested in convincing you or in arguing with you. What would be the point?
From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
04/30/99 20:23:18 PDT


To: knarf
In the first paragraph I said God created everything except man. Perhaps I should have said "had created." I then said God then created an adam who did not choose Him. This one, and many, many more, had the capacity to do that or not do that. God did not interfere with their choice, as He does not interfere with your choices. You are free to choose Him or you may choose anything else to be that for which you will leave everything else but that. Eventually, God created an Adam that chose Him. That one is our father.

God says that humanity is the best thing He has created, and then men become as the lowest of the low. It is their choice to do this. It does not in any way deny the sovereignty of God that He allows us to choose other than Him and walk in other than His Ways. His Dominion is in no way threatened by our failure, just as it is not in any way threatened by the rebellion of Satan. He is The Powerful, and nothing may happen that He does not allow.

It is Satan who desires to convince humanity that he is equal to God. Some become convinced, thinking that there is some kind of contest between Satan and God. This is entirely false: the contest is between Satan and man. God has no competition, except in the eyes of deluded men. Even Satan knows he is no match for God. In the end, he will strip off his cloak of deception and extend his neck in hope of God's Mercy on him. He knows that God's Mercy is so wide that he just might be included in it, after he has done with such dedication and effort what God told him to do: attempt to prove his claim, that man is unworthy of serving God by deceiving and leading astray all he can. In his proof, he will fail. In his dedication and effort, he is in hope of His Mercy, because God told him "This is a path that leads to Me." Satan does not know what he may expect at the end of that path, but he knows where it leads. All paths lead there, some more circuitous than others.

Whether the beliefs of the muslims are faithful to Jesus is a matter that Jesus himself will tell us. We are waiting for him just like you say you are. We expect him any time and believe that it is possible that he is actually among us today. There is no doubt in our minds that he will come among the muslims. Those who believe he will come among the Christians await him there. Some among the Children of Israel, who denied him and his mother, and knowing what you expect and what we expect, are preparing a delusion, a false messiah, to bring him forward in such a way that many will be deceived and think that prophecies -- false prophecies -- are being fulfilled. Jesus is scheduled to arrive shortly thereafter.
From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
04/30/99 20:56:12 PDT


To: GI Jane
That's correct, Ankaboot means spider, and is from the Surah. This question came more quickly than I expected, and it makes me optimistic that there are reasonable people here, as I had hoped, and not as much mindlessness as I have seen elsewhere. Even those who disagree here do so politely, which is a characteristic of the faithful.

This is the Web, right? We regard it as alive -- it is a creature made of smokeless fire, which some would call a spirit. And how many become mired in it? Mr. Web collects people quite readily and holds them in thrall for hours and days, addicting them to his many enticements -- some light and pleasant, others darkened corners calling to forbidden pursuits. It is not really a safe place for the unwary.

But spiders have no problem with webs. Neither do I. Mr. Web and I get along fine. I am not bothered by his occasional caprice, and he does not hypnotize me. I'd just turn him off. But I'm not likely to do that: Mr. Web serves God. Look what he's supporting here at FreeRepublic.
From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
04/30/99 21:29:44 PDT


To: ankaboot
This is mostly just a "bump" so that I can find this thread easily again tomorrow or the next day when I have more time.

I am in receipt of your message and will reply. The end of the week is when I am the busiest in my "off-web" life, so the patience you have already exhibited must serve you a little longer.

One added observation. For so long now conservatives have been attacked from all sides just for opening their mouths and speaking. Consequently, one of our learned responses is to attack anyone who appears to be in disagreement. Again, some patience is required. The vast majority of those who frequent this forum respond reasonably to reason, even if not right away.

Peace.
From: logos (logos@searnet.com) *
05/01/99 06:19:34 PDT


To: ankaboot
Much to ponder--huh?


From: GI Jane (emailname) *
05/01/99 08:44:18 PDT


To: logos
I've heard about this alleged "off-web life" you mention.
From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
05/01/99 16:21:14 PDT

To: ankaboot and Logos
The cultist RR, will have you pilloried for this! Have you not heard the Bible is infallible! Only problem I can't get answered is-- "Which bible in what translation is the 'inerrant' Bible? "
From: Bizdoc (emailname) *
05/01/99 16:39:27 PDT

To: GI Jane
We are creatures of reflection, created in His Reflection.

The eye, looking at the sun, is dazzled; so also its reflection on the water. How then the intellect as it seeks to look upon God rather than ponder His Works? And we ourselves, when wet with the water of His Knowledge, can seem other than clay, and the effect is the more perilous because it is the more immediate.

What gives me pause is not the ill I might find here, for which I may have succour and balm such as God may give me. Rather it is the intoxication of love, while I am already awash in it in a sea of His Mercy, a fountain of the deep and from on high.

Think on Genesis 9:27 and know that it literally says "God Opens to" him: God has Promised a Flood. Prepare to walk on water, and have no care for what it may wash away.

I am a man. I type. His promise to me is true.
From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
05/01/99 16:56:43 PDT


To: Bizdoc
Bizdoc writes: "The cultist RR, will have you pilloried for this! Have you not heard the Bible is infallible! Only problem I can't get answered is -- 'Which bible in what translation is the 'inerrant' Bible?'"

Sounds like an echo from somewhere else -- has there been some comment about the Bible that I missed?

On my shelf are the Scofield, Lamsa (Peshitta), Hertz (Soncino w/Hebrew), the RSV, KJV, NIV, another RSV, the Jerusalem Bible, the Kingdom Interlinear Translation of the Greek Scriptures and the New World Translation, two Arabic Bibles, and the JPS translation of the Masoretic text, and a few other Scriptures and books on Tradition. Hadn't noticed what I would call "error," exactly, but it's clear that the Children of Israel were just as faithful in preserving what they were given in text as they were in everything else. Those I list here are all mutually consistent, for the most part, although the translations simply do not bring into English what is resident in the Hebrew and Arabic texts.

Biblical scholarship reached a peak during the Dark Ages in the muslim lands, where cities of Jewish and Christian scholars, subsidized by the muslim rulers, were able to study preserved manuscripts from the Byzantine and Persian dynasties. And of course over the last thousand years and more, rabbis and bishops have come to us accepting Islam, bringing with them manuscripts as well as memorized texts from the Vatican libraries, for example. It's always a lot of enjoyment to bring original texts out of the semitic tongues into American English, and what is alleged as "error" is usually something quite different. That the Hebrew tongue was reconstructed after the Babylonian Captivity using Arabic as a mathematical model, and the texts recovered by Ezra after the earlier scrolls had been destroyed and speaking a word in Hebrew made a capital offense, had the effect of developing a mysticism that represents the increased wealth of the Arabic, with 28 letters, over the Hebrew, with 22 letters. You can say more in Arabic, that could not be said in the corresponding Hebrew. And it's true, of course.

So I guess RR can bring his stocks and racks, but I think he'll have to contend with someone else.

From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
05/01/99 20:40:43 PDT


To: Bizdoc
Many consider the best Biblical source to be the Vulgate translation of St. Jerome in the Third Century. Nonetheless, even at the third century, much controversy existed. To read an extraordinarily detailed article about St. Jerome and his translation, go to http://www.knight.org/advent/cathen/08341a.htm. An interesting point in the study of Islam is the story of the Mosque with Two Walls. I'd be very interested in our Moslem fellow freeper's version of that story.
From: DonMorgan (emailname) *
05/01/99 21:01:45 PDT

To: DonMorgan
Mr. Morgan writes: "Many consider the best Biblical source to be the Vulgate translation of St. Jerome in the Third Century. Nonetheless, even at the third century, much controversy existed."

Even in the time of Jeremiah there was controversy over the integrity of the Scripture, and in fact ever since Solomon's time. Pre-Christian falsifications are derided by every post-Davidic prophet, testifying that the false "builded a wall and covered it with clay and it will not stand in the great and terrible Day of the Lord."

"An interesting point in the study of Islam is the story of the Mosque with Two Walls. I'd be very interested in our Moslem fellow freeper's version of that story."

Refresh my memory, please. Or do you mean what we call "Masjidal-Qiblatain," the mosque with two qiblas? You ask to open a door that seems not to have been opened very widely for the muslims of the millenial Kingdom, but remains today in the hands of a few, oddly enough including myself. I'll see your hand, please, and then see where to lay the trumps. We'll both win, either way, but this might not be the right table. I'm not calling for a new deal or a cut, but this requires a full deck of cards, all face up with only one joker.

'Nuff said?


From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
05/01/99 23:57:36 PDT


To: ankaboot
You are a beautiful writer with a gift for metaphor, a good natured elegant spider.
From: newyorkgal (emailname) *
05/02/99 00:07:33 PDT

To: newyorkgal
That is very gracious of you. Whatever God gives to me is what He intends for another who has asked or shown a need, and He gives me the wrapping for it as well. I have not the facility He causes others to see, and without someone to taste the honey my life would not be so sweet. The gift is you, and I am grateful to Him for allowing me to be His Pen with which He writes His Mercy upon you.


From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
05/02/99 02:52:42 PDT


To: ankaboot

Sounds like an echo from somewhere else -- has there been some comment about the Bible that I missed?

Bizdoc is an infrequent poster that is one of the remnants of Libertarians that frequented this site. He was "burned at the stake" for saying the bible had truth but was not fact and some other things that the religious right went nuts over. Most of the others from that era of posting have either been banned or left to a new site on Yahoo.


From: Lysander (emailname) *
05/02/99 13:07:28 PDT

To: Lysander
Lysander writes: "Bizdoc is an infrequent poster that is one of the remnants of Libertarians that frequented this site. He was "burned at the stake" for saying the bible had truth but was not fact and some other things that the religious right went nuts over. Most of the others from that era of posting have either been banned or left to a new site on Yahoo."

So JediFU says there is fact but not truth, and that is preferable? And what then of Jeremiah 8:8 and what is unquestionably a statement of some forgery of Scripture by, and they are identified as, lying scribes of Israel? What else did they scribe as Law -- recipes? It seems a tenuous foundation to stand on inerrant Scripture and not know what it says.

Perhaps some are unaware of the book "The Promise of the Land," by Moshe Weinfeld, showing differences in the territories of the Tribes, variances in borders defined by Scripture of different periods. This of course is a very live question in Israel today, which Tribe has right in which district, as settlers are deployed by ideologues to "redeem" the land from the "minim" Christians and the "Ishmaelite" muslims, which of course is ethnic cleansing only outside America, here it is "fulfillment" again, and an organizing tool. But those who divide the land are not at all of one mind on whether this border or that border is "inerrant."

"Burned at the stake" could mean "flamed," I assume. I always find that entertaining when it's aimed at me, but I suppose others find the opinions of men of interest.

So tell me ... how does a "free" forum "ban" a member who provides no ready excuse? It almost seems you describe this as a shouting gallery: are there "big" voices to pronounce anethema, sacred cow agendas, and floor parties that move en mobbe or advance champions?

Well, I am here. Whether I remain in this forum is immaterial to that, I could die tomorrow and the fact would remain established and unerasable, God is waking up people all over the planet and the curve grows steep. So perhaps we'll see who is acceptable to God and who called to account.


From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
05/02/99 19:45:21 PDT


To: ankaboot
"So tell me ... how does a "free" forum "ban" a member who provides no ready excuse? It almost seems you describe this as a shouting gallery: are there "big" voices to pronounce anethema, sacred cow agendas, and floor parties that move en mobbe or advance champions?"

Quite literally people lose their posting privileges. Do not confuse this as a "Free forum" it is not what the name implies. It has been clearly declared and recognized as the private property of the owner. It has been made analogous to his living room. He has guidelines to posting, which if followed are very reasonable. An issue has been that some individuals have been allowed to violate those guidelines and gain forgiveness, and others have been banned quickly. A mitigating factor seems to be the overall contribution to the quality of the site.

There are mobs, (and lap dogs to certain doctrinists) who hold sway at times on this forum. JimRob has a difficult job, and as I have watched him try to perform it, he has gained my respect.

Bizdoc was not banned by JimRob, just cooked by the flamers.


From: Bizdoc (emailname) *
05/03/99 05:29:27 PDT


To: Bizdoc
Bump!
From: astonished (emailname) *
05/03/99 05:52:52 PDT

To: Bizdoc
I did not mean to imply that you were banned. Only deterred from posting.
From: Lysander (emailname) *
05/03/99 10:40:02 PDT

To: Lysander & Bizdoc
Bizdoc writes: "... It has been clearly declared and recognized as the private property of the owner. It has been made analogous to his living room. He has guidelines to posting, which if followed are very reasonable."

Aahh -- house rules. I like house rules. They are can be of great benefit to strangers who come to visit with concern that they not violate customs or hurt peoples' feelings. I visited a community of fundamentalist Rastas some years ago and the brothers were taking advantage of the Ra'is because of his good nature, and with a little snorting and kicking I was able to elevate him in their eyes, leaving them with house rules that gave him due respect for his difficult task of keeping peace within the chaos, and all saw the benefit to themselves.

"An issue has been that some individuals have been allowed to violate those guidelines and gain forgiveness, and others have been banned quickly."

I suspect it comes down to a question of manners. I have no problem with being accused of arbitrariness, the quarrelsome resent the elevation of one over another; but that is the way we have been given, and even the most kind of fathers cannot always please the "why?" of the sons.

"There are mobs (and lap dogs to certain doctrinists) who hold sway at times on this forum. JimRob has a difficult job, and as I have watched him try to perform it, he has gained my respect."

Lap dogs have a taste for hamburger made from sacred cows, of which the tastiest is that of their masters.

"Bizdoc was not banned by JimRob, just cooked by the flamers."

A curious thing that here, where words form the only substance, hot words rather than cool are advanced as reproof. Sear and shiver both call the blood to run, but warming the devil is not nearly so effective as freezing him and taking from him his fiery nature. Those who sit require a measure of warmth from the hearth; flames consume their content and are a measure of what has been consumed, not a measure of what has remained untouched. When there comes a hot response, something has been been consigned to the flames. Those who hated Jesus found no way against him and their devils ate them up. They tried to scorch him but their fire was coolness in his eyes. It confounded them.

Thank you for your welcome, gentlemen. There are those who will see, on me, their own offense reflected. Others will wish to "try the spirit" and find that they lack the means. I am a man as other men: I stumble and falter and err and am in need of His forgiveness. But He makes firm my feet on a sure foundation, and is pleased to send me as a visitor and a guest to the House of JimRob.

I have often been an occasion of consternation among His enemies, who are quick to disclose that which burns within them. I have benefitted from warning and reminder already here: I trust I can also benefit from correction. I hope that when I counsel patience, that a matter may become clarified by further contention, I also can heed such counsel and maintain it. And for any failure of custom or consideration I ask forgiveness and reproof.

And may all who enter the House of JimRob find here much of benefit to themselves. May it please Him to let some of it come through me and beautify the House.


From: ankaboot (ankaboot@muslimamerica.net) *
05/03/99 14:06:43 PDT


To: ankaboot
bump
From: astonished (emailname) *
05/03/99 19:51:03 PDT

To: ankaboot
Just a bump because of the pure pleasure I had reading this thread.

Hope you who are reading this enjoyed it as much as I.
From: Eddie Willers (emailname) *
05/03/99 20:18:38 PDT

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